cpta...@ozemail.com.au I wouldn’t take “presence on Honyaku” as a particularly reliable indicator of translator population. I think that the relationship people have with this or that form of dopamine dispensing app goes through an arc or a life cycle. I was madly active on Honyaku back in the day, then you kind of run out of energy, then I did it with FB, and then left FB altogether ironically because of the censorship. It too was run by scolds who wanted some sterile, idealised, perhaps outdated vision of what “professional” discourse was. It wasn’t lively enough for me basically. Anyone who thinks that in order to fulfil their professional duties translators’ discussion won’t inevitably drag them to and through passionate debate about every topic under the sun, well, I don’t think they understand translation frankly. You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Honyaku E<>J translation list" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to honyaku+u...@googlegroups.com . To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/honyaku/3804D122-A02B-491A-AFA9-F27924657929%40gmail.com . Oroszlany Balazs cpta...@ozemail.com.au “..the purpose seems to be to get a rise out of members who don't agree with the poster, and they're alienating.” You’re right. I apologise. It worked though. But now I feel bad. It can also be the case that I genuinely want to have the discussions too. And as I consider translators to be gods rather than slaves of language, I guess I expect them to be able to handle any topic in any register without “taking offense”. But maybe I am being unrealistic. From: hon...@googlegroups.com < hon...@googlegroups.com > On Behalf Of Jan Cash Sent: Friday, September 8, 2023 8:40 AM To: hon...@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: A lively honyaku Anyone who thinks that in order to fulfil their professional duties translators’ discussion won’t inevitably drag them to and through passionate debate about every topic under the sun, well, I don’t think they understand translation frankly. You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Honyaku E<>J translation list" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to honyaku+u...@googlegroups.com . To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/honyaku/CADXUeAxK2M_LEG6jWc0N3015zqN5fUPkWkq9nnZZyaG_t8-cGw%40mail.gmail.com . I 'm one of the older members since I first joined this list in 1989 when I became a freelance J>E translator. At that time I was overjoyed when I discovered there is actually a list of professional J<->E translators where I could ask language or social questions and discuss the business of translating. In the US at that time, the Apple Macintosh could display Japanese with a word processing package called EG ワード , but it could not connect via a modem. My PC could use a modem, but could not display Japanese. We translated from paper documents that arrived either by post or fax printed on thermosensitive paper. Most of the documents had been photocopied first and were in 4 point font. When faced with a bunch of illegible marks on a page, we could head for our bookcases full of weight-lifting tomes such as the Green Goddess, Brown Behemoth, Nelson, and the IPC technical dictionaries. Honyaku saved the day for me on many occasions, and although some of us could not display those blurry kanji on a PC, we could still figure out their identity through 何々冠、何々偏 and so on together with some context. In many ways, whether living in Japan or elsewhere, we were lucky to have a group of people who were willing to help in deciphering an exotic language that was in very high demand, or in return, provide background information for Japanese documents about the US when their content was confusing to translators living in Japan. Younger translators probably cannot envision the conditions we worked under, but they were as modern as technology allowed at that time. Because freelance translating is a solitary occupation, the Honyaku mailing list also served as our social media platform, and vicariously we became friendly and personal with many people we could never expect to meet face-to-face during our lifetime. That may explain why some of the back-and-forth on the list appears to younger translators as unprofessional. Posters who express matters of personal opinion write under the assumption that we all belong to the same community working toward common goals. Although members will sometimes disagree, we belong to the same group and will help each other out if asked despite differences in personality and temperament. Younger translators are always welcome. cpta...@ozemail.com.au One of the reasons FB took off is because it has a “like” button, for posts like John’s.. From: hon...@googlegroups.com < hon...@googlegroups.com > On Behalf Of John Stroman Sent: Saturday, September 9, 2023 3:56 AM To: hon...@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: A lively honyaku I'm one of the older members since I first joined this list in 1989 when I became a freelance J>E translator. At that time I was overjoyed when I discovered there is actually a list of professional J<->E translators where I could ask language or social questions and discuss the business of translating. In the US at that time, the Apple Macintosh could display Japanese with a word processing package called EG ワード , but it could not connect via a modem. My PC could use a modem, but could not display Japanese. We translated from paper documents that arrived either by post or fax printed on thermosensitive paper. Most of the documents had been photocopied first and were in 4 point font. ----------------

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/honyaku/CAJVTx95g%2B64XVKfw3kT9WB%2BwXwNgmiH-0WvBqLaqgCHHDXOtig%40mail.gmail.com . timl...@aol.com cpta...@ozemail.com.au “There was even a comment in another thread that the list is probably mostly white and old.” Yes but thanks to colonialism and imperialism old white men DO constitute a repository of all that diverse cultures have to offer, so you know, all good. From: hon...@googlegroups.com < hon...@googlegroups.com > On Behalf Of Jan Cash Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2023 4:58 AM To: hon...@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: A lively honyaku I'm not sure this list is very diverse though. There was even a comment in another thread that the list is probably mostly white and old. There's also a difference between allowing anyone to join and welcoming others to be here. You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Honyaku E<>J translation list" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to honyaku+u...@googlegroups.com . To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/honyaku/CADXUeAzgA6angBpRCzBnnFsrwAgk221zD%2BawsWd%2Bo4-J_OEwFg%40mail.gmail.com . timl...@aol.com cpta...@ozemail.com.au “…. this will be my last message and I will no longer recommend this listserve to other people.” Well this is very regrettable. “…simply write these things for the reaction….” Everything we do in life is “for the reaction”. But I don’t want to accidentally kick Honyaku when it is down. If the moderators want to agree with Jan that I am a “racist’ feel free to say so, ban me and advise Jan that people like me are not accepted. Then beg her to return and judge others by their age, skin colour or whatever amorphous personal hurt is current. To the tolerant, diverse views of diversity are intolerable, and then can be only one kind of “be kind”. I will seek reactions to my views of MT and AI in another email. From: hon...@googlegroups.com < hon...@googlegroups.com > On Behalf Of Tom Gally Sent: Monday, September 11, 2023 6:52 PM To: hon...@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: A lively honyaku I included the wrong link at the end of my last post. My apologies. Here is the correct link to the GPT-4 chat from last week: https://chat.openai.com/share/90e340be-b6f0-45ec-a116-22145d104234 To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/honyaku/CACnS3Ne%3Du1%3DN9w3x8iJ%3D32yuTvymqHE_J1MeEiBOzV-TOyP%2BtQ%40mail.gmail.com .